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Post by osha on May 2, 2017 12:01:36 GMT -7
Two percent tax for everyone and problem solved.
Really, that simple. But instead they all lie and play into the hands of the ultra rich and we peons who keep this country moving are just disposable obedient workers.
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Post by osha on May 2, 2017 11:56:10 GMT -7
So your basically saying: What you believe in should be adhered to but what others believe makes them snowflakes. This is what your saying in a nutshell. It's all right for people to be forced to listen to something they don't want to (because they are not forced to believe those ideas) But when people force your ideas to shut up, they are snowflakes. So one wants to cram their crap down your throat and the other wants the crammer to shut up. Isn't freedom wonderful? What? No, that's not what I am "basically saying" at all. Again, WHO is forcing anyone to listen to something that they don't want to? It's the leftist mob that is using violence to silence any dissent....THEY are forcing their beliefs, not conservatives. Liberal professors force conservative students....students that PAID for the class....to listen to things they don't want to ON A DAILY BASIS. We'll be waiting on your condemnation of these professors with the same fervor that you have demonstrated against a peaceful non mandatory event at Berkley. And people that "force...ideas to shut up" ARE not just snowflakes, they are little leftist despots....amateur liberal fascists who have no respect for the freedoms of others...who use censorship and violent intimidation to stifle the legitimate ideas of others that they disagree with. I believe ALL politics should be out of school. That means liberal and conservative. And yes, I believe both sides are wrong on the issue. I am not liberal or conservative and don't feel that either of those political ideologies should be force fed to anyone. And violence is never the answer in these situations. It's wrong in my book to complain about liberal teachings and at the same time complain when a right wing speaker can't be guilty of the same thing. How about we support ALL politics being removed from school? That even means liberal professors. Then what we get in return is no catch 22 to start with.
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Post by osha on May 1, 2017 10:50:35 GMT -7
My point is, if I am a paying consumer somewhere, I should not be forced to listen to anything I don't want to. Really? So when you show up at WalMart they should change the background music to whatever you like? "Hey, osha is here! Put on Madonna quick, that's his favorite." That's called arrogance. I'll say again, the Coulter event was sponsored and organised by conservative campus students. These students also pay tuition and fees to attend the school. What about their rights? What does that even mean? Free speech and freedom of choice are separate but equal rights, but with social limits. You can't yell "fire" in a crowded theater if there is no fire. You can choose whether or not to shop at WalMart, but you cannot demand that they play Madonna for you just because you don't like their background music. We are, after all, a free society. This means that your wants or likes should not infringe upon others that choose to not join your interests. I agree with you and that's why I said it is a catch 22. Saying that one group has the right to force students (through tests or whatnot) to sit through something they don't enjoy is infringing on the rights of others. I don't believe politics should be in schools anyways. But to cover all freedoms in a free world, yes, the kids that want the event should have the event and others should respect that. But, it becomes an issue when things are forced as they would be in a school. Changing the music is a good one lol. I would never advocate for such a thing.
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Post by osha on May 1, 2017 10:30:46 GMT -7
These kids also pay good money for their education. As I said, it's a catch 22 in my book. How many teachers would have forced these kids to listen to these speakers for a test or grade of some sort? That would have happened to some degree. I support free speech but I also support the freedom of choice. And your freedom of speech is not more important then my freedom to choose. If your free speech forced me to endure something I don't enjoy, your infringing on me. It's a catch 22. Who is forcing these kids? No one. Even if a professor required attendance by some students, no one is required to adhere to or believe in those ideas. On the other hand, the despicable snowflakes that threatened violence have made their ideas mandatory through the threat of violence. The cancellation of the Coulter event took that choice away from those individuals who wanted to hear her ideas; doesn't that "infringe" on them? "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
So your basically saying: What you believe in should be adhered to but what others believe makes them snowflakes. This is what your saying in a nutshell. It's all right for people to be forced to listen to something they don't want to (because they are not forced to believe those ideas) But when people force your ideas to shut up, they are snowflakes. So one wants to cram their crap down your throat and the other wants the crammer to shut up. Isn't freedom wonderful?
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Post by osha on May 1, 2017 9:14:46 GMT -7
I am torn on that issue. I support free speech but I should not have to listen to someone in Walmart or have someone forcibly come into my home and speech in a way I don't support. College kids are paying much money for their education. Should they as consumers be forced to listen to someone they don't like? It's a catch 22 in my book. On one hand I support free speech and on the other I support the right to also get what I want from what I pay for. IMHO, politics should not be involved in school anyways. How can someone force you to listen to anything in Wallmart? If someone forces themselves into your home, SHOOT THEM. That'll shut em up. I have guns and know how to use them. My point is, if I am a paying consumer somewhere, I should not be forced to listen to anything I don't want to. The right makes it seem as if one should be strapped to a chair with a muzzle on because others have free speech. I say that free speech does not trump the freedom of choice.
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Post by osha on May 1, 2017 7:24:14 GMT -7
I see it a bit of a different way. If a college student attends a college, they are paying for that college. They are keeping the lights on, paying for the place where the event will be held, paying for the chairs for people to sit in and so forth. Unfairly looking at someone and telling them to pay for something they don't support is wrong. They are trying to slam the door. The bad thing is the only way to get things done anymore is to be loud about it. I don't agree with riots and destroying property and such, but such actions did earn the desired outcome. There needs to be more direct communication in this country and if there was, things like riots would happen much less. These closed avenues of resolution do little to solve any problem. If this was the standard, then no speech would be allowed anywhere. As a non parasite taxpayer (i.e., not a liberal), my taxes go to pay for the colleges in the state where I live; any grants from the federal government are also dipping into the money that I paid in. Would I therefore have a say in these decisions as well if I was a California taxpayer? As a payer of federal taxes, wouldn't I have a say in California no matter what state is my home? The PARENTS of these left wing collegiate thugs are the ones who pay the bills as do the taxpayers in most states and even the poor souls buying lottery tickets help out. Do they have a say? If any one of them says that they don't like liberal professors poisoning these young minds, should those professors be fired? How about if a liberal says the same thing about conservative professors? Unlike the event in question, the students actually are forced to listen to these despicably biased leftist professors every day. The point is that that Constitution does not stipulate that free speech is restricted only to venues where all of the funding comes from agreeable folk. No one was forcing anyone to go listen to Ann Coulter, nor were there any restrictions on liberals if they want to bring in their own speakers. THAT'S free speech...I thought the free flow of ideas was what colleges were paid to encourage. Evidently, only liberal ideas are allowed. The last, undeniable point is that it is primarily liberals trying to stifle ideas that they agree with, not conservatives. These kids also pay good money for their education. As I said, it's a catch 22 in my book. How many teachers would have forced these kids to listen to these speakers for a test or grade of some sort? That would have happened to some degree. I support free speech but I also support the freedom of choice. And your freedom of speech is not more important then my freedom to choose. If your free speech forced me to endure something I don't enjoy, your infringing on me. It's a catch 22.
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Post by osha on Apr 30, 2017 21:13:02 GMT -7
Really, no.
Republicans refuse to help find solutions to problems that people face today.
Like college costs and debt. Like medical insurance (which I'm sure their plan will be worse and not better). Like money in politics (the rich making legislation to help the rich through dollars). Like medicaid/care which is needed by many people. Like climate change which science backs but they deny. Like poverty that is a real problem.
The list could go on. We could even talk about terrorists and how we create them. But the right does not want to talk about these things at all. Instead they would rather just cut, cut, cut and cut more playing into the Koch brothers playbook. Not to even mention Social Security.
Why is it we are the richest nation on earth and yet other nations have medical for all, free college, family medical leave paid, Italy even has like 20 vacation days a year. Why are we where we are? Answer:
It don't help the rich...
And the establishment Democrats don't get a get of jail free card on this either.
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Post by osha on Apr 30, 2017 15:04:35 GMT -7
So your saying that one group should have the right to free speech while the other don't?
Your saying I should allow Nancy Pelosi into my house (who I can't stand) and I should shut up about it?
Baby boomers are probably a bit to old to riot lol.
Trump supporters have done their fair share of bull.
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Post by osha on Apr 30, 2017 14:13:50 GMT -7
I am torn on that issue. I support free speech but I should not have to listen to someone in Walmart or have someone forcibly come into my home and speech in a way I don't support. College kids are paying much money for their education. Should they as consumers be forced to listen to someone they don't like? It's a catch 22 in my book. On one hand I support free speech and on the other I support the right to also get what I want from what I pay for. IMHO, politics should not be involved in school anyways. You should not have to listen to anything you don't want to listen to. You can leave WalMart, close your front door, and students could choose to not go to the event. That's freedom. Some protesters push the limits of free speech by blocking traffic or sidewalks & doorways. You're free do disagree, but not to be disagreeable to others. We do not have the right to riot or infringe upon others. If the violence doesn't stop, you can bet that "politicism" will become a social crime, just like racism, the gender thing, sexual orientation, and religion. Where did all of the adults go? I see it a bit of a different way. If a college student attends a college, they are paying for that college. They are keeping the lights on, paying for the place where the event will be held, paying for the chairs for people to sit in and so forth. Unfairly looking at someone and telling them to pay for something they don't support is wrong. They are trying to slam the door. The bad thing is the only way to get things done anymore is to be loud about it. I don't agree with riots and destroying property and such, but such actions did earn the desired outcome. There needs to be more direct communication in this country and if there was, things like riots would happen much less. These closed avenues of resolution do little to solve any problem.
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Post by osha on Apr 30, 2017 12:16:26 GMT -7
Liberals rioting against a speaker because of their political beliefs. Is this going to be the next PC law to include politicism as a hate crime? I am torn on that issue. I support free speech but I should not have to listen to someone in Walmart or have someone forcibly come into my home and speech in a way I don't support. College kids are paying much money for their education. Should they as consumers be forced to listen to someone they don't like? It's a catch 22 in my book. On one hand I support free speech and on the other I support the right to also get what I want from what I pay for. IMHO, politics should not be involved in school anyways.
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Post by osha on Apr 29, 2017 21:41:26 GMT -7
Those are two interesting attempts to justify liberal policies. Why don't you just tell the truth? Liberals hope to convince folks that they cannot survive or prosper without government help. It's that simple. Well, it's true. When the government has kept creating policy that has buried our young folks, who is responsible for the problem? Government gets into giving student loans and costs skyrocket. Government keeps trade agreements and jobs suffer. Government messes with healthcare and keeps costs rising. Government favors large corporations and regulations show it. Government keeps wages low to benefit the wealthy. And the list could go on.... Watch Where to invade next and look at how much poorer countries are doing much better then we are.
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Post by osha on Apr 29, 2017 12:45:13 GMT -7
Of course and then we wonder why we even have Liberals. You have the baby boomers who grew up with tons of opportunity. College was cheap and affordable, housing was cheap, transportation was cheap, most mothers were home with the children and so on. Now, we are telling young people to do the right thing and get educated and the job prospects keep dwindling for the educated. The answer from the right? Go to school for industries you may dislike because that might be where the jobs are. In other words, grow up hating life working in a position you never wanted to because that is all that's left. While the same people spewing this garbage enjoy their job and love their life because they had choice in a growing economy. Then these young people see the ever rising price of medical insurance. Premiums rise and deductibles rise while few of us normal peons even have any money saved. A $6000 dollar deductible? Really? www.cnbc.com/2016/10/03/how-much-americans-at-every-age-have-in-their-savings-accounts.htmlThen the republicans refuse to acknowledge the people are suffering and inflation robs the saver and the worker. If wages followed inflation people today would be making north of 20 bucks and hour. But no, you have the right preaching that people are not trying hard enough. Then they look at older people who have paid into social security their whole life and they want to cut the "entitlements" to give tax cuts to the rich. Or they want to raise the age to such a high number that you die before ever collecting a dime. So we have low job prospects, high college costs, outrageous medical costs, social security constantly threatened, trickle down economics for the rich (which never created one job), housing that is to expensive and forces young people to live with parents, people who have left the job market because of lack of opportunity, world being destroyed by climate change and the right ignoring science and the list can go on.... And then we wonder why we have a seemly crazy far left wing of the democrat party. These people are not rural bible thumpers and are not 4th generation farmers, they have real problems and they are battling a system that has stacked the cards against them.
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Post by osha on Apr 28, 2017 16:44:26 GMT -7
Yep, that's true.
I believe we could solve many of our problems if we would just come together and discuss the issues and come to agreement. Bickering back and forth does nothing at all except cause gridlock that benefits nobody at all.
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Post by osha on Apr 28, 2017 14:15:07 GMT -7
This can actually be summed up easily:
Liberal- I believe in free speech as long as it aligns with my ideology.
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Post by osha on Apr 26, 2017 11:15:46 GMT -7
I'm under the impression our capabilities kind of go without saying.
NK knows who and what they are messing with. I just don't think they have the sense to act accordingly. Of course, unless Kim is all hot air as usual.
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